It's Official - Challanger to be Lame Piece of ****

[4 cam torino]

http://www.allpar.com/cars/dodge/challenger.html

I said a million times it was going to be lame. Everyone that was anticipating something bad ass, sorry, it's lame just like I said it would be. Quarter mile "under 14 seconds" for 38 grand while getting less than 20 MPG highway? :rofl: Go buy a used GTO. And that 38,000 is before the gas guzzler tax :rofl:

[GTPpower]

wow...looks like the camaro will walk all over that thing. They need to make it go on a diet

[turbodaytona87]

Its right on par with current SRT-8's prolly going to run a 13.5

[Alley]

Camaro is probably going to be the same for weight and 1/4 mile times. Just the way things are now. Please quit with the lame talk about it being 38k for a 13 second car. Its brand new dumbasses. go buy a 98 LS1 for 10k if you want a cheap 13 second car. YOu can't compare new and used cars when talking about price.

[Thunder]

Camaro is probably going to be the same for weight and 1/4 mile times. Just the way things are now. Please quit with the lame talk about it being 38k for a 13 second car. Its brand new dumbasses. go buy a 98 LS1 for 10k if you want a cheap 13 second car. YOu can't compare new and used cars when talking about price.

cept 10 bux says the camaro will be faster and be 5k cheaper.

[Alley]

proof?

[swaggy853]

take the $10 bet and find out when they come out.

[toom1h]

Simply because they slapped on SRT8 it will be more expensive..
If I had the money I'd get it. It looks bad ass!

Put in gears and go.

[Thunder]

proof?

Do you honestly need proof when we're talking GM and MOPAR here?

[Thunder]

Simply because they slapped on SRT8 it will be more expensive..
If I had the money I'd get it. It looks bad ass!

Put in gears and go.

The allpar site says that the 6 SPD version thats to be released, will have 3.92 LSD. I dont know if you want to gear it much more.

[toom1h]

proof?

Do you honestly need proof when we're talking GM and MOPAR here?

Thanks for the clarification junior

[Thunder]

The last time MOPAR had anything to compete with GM was 1978. Before that was probably 72. Since then, its been GM/Ford battle. I know all you turbo dodge guys are going to jump on my case, but so be it ... a few rare cars that would hang don't count as being part of the competition.

[Thunder]

and to be honest, that 1978 was because of the lil red (thanks ryan) but I shouldn't count it since they made what, ~2100 of those trucks?

[David]

I love the new camaro... but alley is right.. the new camaro is going to be a pig... you do realize the camaro used in Transformer was a GTO right??? They chopped it up and GM hooked them up with the cosmetic parts to "convert" it to a camaro... i'm honestly not expecting anything more from a 6.0 camaro than i do from the 6.0 GTO.

[Lepa]

The last time MOPAR had anything to compete with GM was 1978.


:rofl:

[Lepa]

and to be honest, that 1978 was because of the lil red (thanks ryan) but I shouldn't count it since they made what, ~2100 of those trucks?

Oh it counts when it blew the corvette out of the water in the 1/4th lol.

[David]

and to be honest, that 1978 was because of the lil red (thanks ryan) but I shouldn't count it since they made what, ~2100 of those trucks?

Oh it counts when it blew the corvette out of the water in the 1/4th lol.


pulling up next a vette with no one in it and romping on it isn't exactly racing.

[Lepa]

Damnit, how'd u find out what happened.

[Thunder]

the lack of performance from late 70s vettes is very disturbing.

[srt-4_uk]

proof?

Do you honestly need proof when we're talking GM and MOPAR here?

yeah because the GTO and the Charger was a bad comparison

[Thunder]

proof?

Do you honestly need proof when we're talking GM and MOPAR here?

yeah because the GTO and the Charger was a bad comparison

whys that

[srt-4_uk]

sorry quoted the wrong thing. You said the last time Mopar had something to compare was the 70s. I was saying the GTO and the Charger compared quite nicely.

[Thunder]

Yeah, the last few years with the GTO/Charger was a good comparison, but before both there was a very big drought.

[Johnny]

price aside, I think that it looks good, and will move decent enough, I mean ****, alley's car moves nice. tho it should really in all honesty blow chargers away... tho clearly it will not.

tho I really do want to puke in the interior of every single one of them.

sounds like with tires a person might be able to knock down a 13.00 at sea level

maybe a 12.9 not too bad considering its brand new...

but with price... eh

[srt-4_uk]

Just wait for the manual tranny. Mopar is really bad with the Tq limiting in the AT.

[turbodaytona87]

No kidding, they some stonger ass auto trannys.

[turbodaytona87]

and to be honest, that 1978 was because of the lil red (thanks ryan) but I shouldn't count it since they made what, ~2100 of those trucks?

Oh it counts when it blew the corvette out of the water in the 1/4th lol.


pulling up next a vette with no one in it and romping on it isn't exactly racing.

Bah you're just mad that a 4000lb Dodge pickup could beat gm's performance car

[GTPpower]

I don't see the camaro being about the same as the challenger. From everything I've heard, it's supposed to be lighter than the mopar, and I don't think they are using the 6.0 anymore. From some stuff I've heard, it sounds more like the LS3.

[00dakotav8]

I still want one regardless of the hate, I just want a 6 spd one.

[LastPewterZ]

I hate the production rear facia and I absolutely wanna **** and **** all over the interior! 4100 pounds kind of a big disappointment, but with a manual tranny it would be somewhat better. Definitely leaning towards the new Camaro now!

[Alley]

Thunder, about no competition after 1970's. Ever heard of the Viper?

I was suprised in that article it said the Challenger is actually heavier then the Charger. 4,1XX vs. 4,0XX.

[Thunder]

Thunder, about no competition after 1970's. Ever heard of the Viper?

I was suprised in that article it said the Challenger is actually heavier then the Charger. 4,1XX vs. 4,0XX.

The viper? You mean Dodges attempt at an overpriced underpower overrated super car? Its just NOW that they finally are decent (recent SRT10s)

[STOK5OH]

Either way,at least it isn't a ****ING 4 DOORK.

[C.J.]

I am saying it again...there is not a ****ing chance a stripper model v8 Camaro will be anywhere near that kind of money.

I also would like to add that it is indeed Brad who made this thread about how lame the new challenger is and how slow and overpriced it is. When it comes to qualified personnel to make an assumption like that he is most likely comparing it with the new Camaro which I am assuming w/o a doubt he is the only person to see them and know what is really going on with them. (production models)

[Alley]

So what did Chevy have that competed with the 92 Viper? It had 400HP and ran high 12's. Doesn't sound underpowered or overrated to me. That was pretty heathly for the early 90's. LT1 had what? 275HP or something? give me a break. Not to mention the AWD TT Dodge Stealth. /thread

[C.J.]

So what did Chevy have that competed with the 92 Viper? It had 400HP and ran high 12's. Doesn't sound underpowered or overrated to me. That was pretty heathly for the early 90's. LT1 had what? 275HP or something? give me a break. Not to mention the AWD TT Dodge Stealth. /thread

newb....ever heard of ZR1 corvette w/ LT5? Best recorded stock time was low 12s...made 385hp

[STOK5OH]

fraid no on the /thread.

[C.J.]

so in reality the regular 330hp ZR1 corvette which was nothign more than alittle more aggressive LT1 was running around what a Viper was in the early 90s for about half the price.

[00dakotav8]

how many zr1s did they make? How many vipers did they make?

[C.J.]

how many zr1s did they make? How many vipers did they make?

probably about the same, they were just about the same price. I have seen more LT5 ZR1's than 93-95 RT10 Vipers in real life at random car shows. Then again who wouldn't want a DOHC 32 valve Lotus inspired V8 over some hack job v10 truck engine. Oh and don't get me started on the interiors....the vipers didn't even come with roll up/down windows, they just hooked on to the door like jeep wranglers. AWESOME and definitely worth that $70k!

[Alley]

lol, a 92 viper wasn't even close to 70k noob. More like 50k. The point is the ZR1 does compare to the Viper. So Thunders original comment was wrong. He said Dodge had no cars after the 1970's that compare to anything Chevy was doing. Obviously he was wrong.

I'm also not buying the ZR1 Vette running low 12's. If that was the case waht the heck is wrong with the 350HP LS1 vette only running 13's stock? They must of took a step backwards in engineering if the LT5 at 385 HP is a full second faster. Guess the LS1 was a step backwards?

[Thunder]

lol, a 92 viper wasn't even close to 70k noob. The point is the ZR1 does compare to the Viper. So Thunders original comment was wrong. He said Dodge had no cars after the 1970's that compare to anything Chevy was doing. Obviously he was wrong.

I'm also not buying the ZR1 Vette running low 12's. If that was the case waht the heck is wrong with the 350HP LS1 vette only running 13's stock? They must of took a step backwards in engineering if the LT5 at 385 HP is a full second faster. Guess the LS1 was a step backwards?

I should have clarified myself a little bit, sorry :rolleye: Dodge didn't have an affordable performance car offered... one that the general public can afford... not everyone is going out and giving consideration to buy a viper...basically mopar failed to compete with the Camaro/Firebird/Mustang. Happy now?

[Thunder]

I'm also not buying the ZR1 Vette running low 12's. If that was the case waht the heck is wrong with the 350HP LS1 vette only running 13's stock? They must of took a step backwards in engineering if the LT5 at 385 HP is a full second faster. Guess the LS1 was a step backwards?

The LS1 and LT5 are 2 totally different engines. The LT5 is pretty much an exotic motor. The LS1 is a mass produced V8. It cost way more to make the LT5 but I also have a feeling it was a bit underrated. It also made insane power on the top end, and the cars were probably geared accordingly and C4s didn't weigh as much as C5s as far as I know?

[Alley]

sounds like the ZR1 is actually the overpriced, overrated, poser supercar then.

[c0z]

I still love the overall shape of the car, but am going to agree that for some reason the rear facia looks extremely gay on the production version, very girly. Also the interior looks like a mix between a truck and a luxury kia.

[Thunder]

sounds like the ZR1 is actually the overpriced, overrated, poser supercar then.

except it wiped the floor with the viper... hence why the viper gets the title of overrated and overpriced poser.

[82355]

LT5's were 385 and then 405 in 1993.

Martin

[Alley]

Back on topic. I can't wait till you guys go all emo on the new Camaro once you see it will be just as heavy as the Challenger and just as pricey. Just the way things are now. Get with the times.

[Prez]

Pretty sure the interior was designed by Kia's 1994 design team.

[82355]

It looks way better than the Camaro. Too bad about the b pillar though.

Martin

[David]

Back on topic. I can't wait till you guys go all emo on the new Camaro once you see it will be just as heavy as the Challenger and just as pricey. Just the way things are now. Get with the times.



i'll agree to most of that... but as for the Zr1 running 12's... no way will it run 12's... THe zo6 run's 11's with the average driver and high 10's with a bad ass driver. ZR1 has an additional 100hp....

[Thunder]

i think they were talking about the old LT5 ZR1

[¿umop apisdn]

Weren't they talking about old ZR-1s?

http://www.joby.se/corvette/div/corvette_wheels/95zr1.jpeg
http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en-commons/thumb/3/30/250px-GMLT5.JPG

[Thunder]

its like TPI on steroids

[Alley]

David = NOOB

[David]

ya... i just read the post about the Zr1 running 12's and got my panties in a knot. Carry on.

[David]

http://www.dougrippie.com/images/black%20widow%20engine.jpg

black widow FTMFW!!!!!
http://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/specs/c4/zr1/blackwidow.html

[srt-4_uk]

I should have clarified myself a little bit, sorry :rolleye: Dodge didn't have an affordable performance car offered... one that the general public can afford... not everyone is going out and giving consideration to buy a viper...basically mopar failed to compete with the Camaro/Firebird/Mustang. Happy now?

Its "sports car" title may come into question but the SRT-4 Caliber or Neon will make a Camaro/Mustang/Firebird look really silly. Not to mention the Crossfire SRT-6. Even tho the MSRP is high, they could be had for 25K-28K brand new because of the low demand.

[Thunder]

Its "sports car" title may come into question but the SRT-4 Caliber or Neon will make a Camaro/Mustang/Firebird look really silly. Not to mention the Crossfire SRT-6. Even tho the MSRP is high, they could be had for 25K-28K brand new because of the low demand.

what? SRT4 neons bone stock were upper 14s. You modify them and get into the 13s. I don't know how that makes fbodys and mustangs look silly lol. I mean sure you can do all sorts of crazy stuff and pull off the 12.5 that doug did with his srt4.... but 12.5 is hardly anything that makes camaros look silly, unless you're racing a stock one sure.

[srt-4_uk]

Stock neons ran low 14s consistantly with a skilled driver and the caliber knocks off about the same times. Fast enough to outrun the new mustangs. Against a camaro/firebird, it would be a drivers race.

[CrazyPete]

Thunder Thunder Thunder where do i start...........or should i just walk away

[Thunder]

Thunder Thunder Thunder where do i start...........or should i just walk away

don't walk, inform me.

[Yogi]

FS: 2004 Jeep Rubicon














No doubt about it, getting an 09. Then I'll have a Challenger that I can drive.....

[Thunder]

FS: 2004 Jeep Rubicon














No doubt about it, getting an 09. Then I'll have a Challenger that I can drive.....

aw but the one you have is 20x cooler.

[Yogi]

Yeah but it's not gonna be outa the shop for awhile......

[Thunder]

define "a while"... wouldn't it be worth the wait?

[Yogi]

another year or two at least, so it will be worth the wait BUT I want one of both.

[Thunder]

well be patient at least and wait til year 2 of the challengers. No one wants a first year car. Gotta work those bugs out :lol:

[Yogi]

Thats why it'll be an 09 not an 08

[srt-4_uk]

Plus you miss the good things Dodge adds as standard the second year.

[Alley]

Wait till 2010. Article said we could see the 6.4ltr Hemi in there by then.

[Thunder]

what is that thing in your sig craig?

[Alley]

Bugati. Just picked one up.

[Thunder]

the store don't pay you THAT well.

[srt-4_uk]

Wait till 2010. Article said we could see the 6.4ltr Hemi in there by then.
By then you might as wait till 2014 because then there will be something better.

[CrazyPete]

Thats why it'll be an 09 not an 08


if you want one buy a late 08/09 the rumors are they will still be collectable numbered and the special editions will be out in late 08. Like the trans am edition and so on. The full choice of colors and more interior options the six speed will be a huge improvement over the slush box auto. As far as the weight issue get use to it all new mid size cars are gonna be that heavy. Get rid of all the bullshit eletronics ecus and saftey crap and you'll have the desired weight. You gotta remember the REAL e bodys weighted 3400-3700 lbs. depending on engine size, suspention options and other packages. Personally im not a big fan of the 6.1 hemi yeah it makes good power but theres so much more it could be made from the factory. The new 6.4 (392ci) and the 426 thats still in final devloipment looks much better. The body ques on the new challenger are decent but i think there will be some changes in the future. The ass end looks like crap on the production model im sure that will change. The front end looks sexy and the interior seems ok they down scaled it big time from the concept. Im gonna have to see it in person before ill make final judgement.

[Yogi]

If they decide to put the 426 in it, I'll wait until i can get that one

[¿umop apisdn]

er a 440. I'd LOVE a new challenger vanishing point style

http://www.classicmuscle.net/1970%20Dodge%20Challenger%20RT/side.jpgSEX

[supercrackerbox]

the lack of performance from late 70s vettes is very disturbing.

There was NOTHING in the late '70s that performed well. That was the darkest of the dark ages. Only reason the 'Lil Red got away with it was because they were able to sidestep the emissions requirements that the cars had to meet.

And BTW, the GLHS and CSX were right on the Corvette's tail in '87. First was the Grand National, next was the Vette, then the Shelbys, then the Mustang, and then the Camaro. In fact, every year from 1984 to 1992 there was a turbo Mopar that was as fast, if not faster than the Camaro.

And the Stealth was a rebadged Mitsubishi btw.

[82355]

Turbo Mopar's were running low 14's in 1992?

Martin

[STOK5OH]

YA,duh.

[Thunder]

How many GLHS's and CSX's did they make?

[CrazyPete]

got this email from dodge today kinda cool vid

http://dodge.innovyx.net/v?xJlqnnWEcvlHnnJP

[veemaxx]

This has probably been posted before but here is a slightly dated set of lists of fastest 1/4 times from magazines of the day.


50 Fastest Muscle Cars



These are the fastest muscle cars of all time, as ranked by Muscle Car Review Magazine, the source on muscle cars. This ranking was developed by comparing muscle cars as measured by different, respected sources, which were then ranked by their respective quarter mile elapsed times.


50 FASTEST MUSCLECARS
# YEAR/MODEL ET/MPH ENGINE HP TRANS GEAR SOURCE
1 1966 427 Cobra 12.20@118 427 8V 425 4-Speed 3.54 CC 11/65
2 1966 Corvette 427 12.8@112 L72 427 425 4-Speed 3.36 CD 11/65
3 1969 Road Runner 12.91@111.8 440 Six BBL 390 4-Speed 4.10 SS 6/69
4 1970 Hemi Cuda 13.10@107.12 426 Hemi 425 4-Speed 3.54 CC 11/69
5 1970 Chevelle SS454 13.12@107.01 454 LS6 450 4-Speed 3.55 CC 11/69
6 1969 Camaro 13.16@110.21 427 ZL1 430 4-Speed 4.10 HC 6/69
7 1968 Corvette 13.30@108 427 6V 435 4-Speed 3.70 HC 5/68
8 1970 Road Runner 13.34@107.5 426 Hemi 425 automatic 4.10 SS 12/69
9 1970 Buick GS Stage I 13.38@105.5 455 Stage I 360 automatic 3.64 MT 1/70
10 1968 Corvette 427 13.41@109.5 L72 427 425 4-Speed 3.55 CD 6/68
11 1969 Charger 500 13.48@109 426 Hemi 425 4-Speed 4.10 HR 2/69
12 1968 Charger 13.50@105 426 Hemi 425 automatic 3.23 CD 11/67
12 1970 Plymouth Superbird 13.50@105 426 Hemi 425 ? ? ?
14 1968 Road Runner 13.54@105.1 426 Hemi 425 automatic 3.55 CD 1/69
15 1973 Trans Am 13.54@104.29 455 SD 310 automatic 3.42 HR 6/73
16 1969 Corvette 13.56@111.1 427 L88 430 automatic 3.36 HR 4/69
17 1969 Super Bee 13.56@105.6 440 Six Pack 390 automatic 4.10 HR 8/69
18 1969 Boss 429 Mustang 13.60@106 Boss 429 375 4-Speed 3.91 HC 9/69
19 1970 Challenger R/T 13.62@104.3 440 Six Pack 390 automatic 3.23 CC 11/69
20 1970 Torino Cobra 13.63@105.9 429 SCJ 370 automatic 3.91 SS 3/70
21 1968 Biscayne 13.65@105 427 L72 425 4-Speed 4.56 SS 4/68
22 1964 Polara 500 13.70@107.37 426 4V 365 4-Speed 3.23 HC 2/64
23 1969 GTX 13.70@102.8 440 4V 375 automatic 4.10 MT 1/69
24 1969 Dart 440 13.71@105 440 4V 375 automatic 3.55 CC 5/69
25 1971 Road Runner 13.71@101.2 440 Six BBL 390 automatic 4.10 CC 1/71
26 1971 Cuda 13.72@106 440 Six BBL 390 automatic 4.10 SS 4/71
27 1971 Corvette 13.72@102.04 454 LS6 450 4-Speed 3.36 CL 8/71
28 1971 Super Bee 13.73@104 426 Hemi 425 automatic 4.10 MT 12/70
29 1968 Hurst/Olds 13.77@103.91 455 W-30 390 automatic 3.91 SS 8/68
30 1970 Hemi 'Cuda 13.78@101.2 426 Hemi 425 automatic 4.10 MT 9/69
31 1968 Firebird 13.79@106 400 HO 335 4-Speed N/A HR 3/68
32 1967 Corvette 13.80@108 427 6V 435 4-Speed 3.55 HR 5/67
33 1965 Catalina 13.80@106 421 6V ? 4-Speed 3.42 CD 3/65
34 1969 Super Bee Six Pack 13.80@104.2 440 Six BBL 390 automatic 4.10 CD 7/69
35 1971 Boss 351 Mustang 13.80@104 Boss 351 330 4-Speed 3.91 MT 1/71
36 1966 Satellite 13.81@104 426 Hemi 425 4-Speed 3.54 CD 4/66
37 1969 Coronet R/T 13.83@102.27 440 4V 375 4-Speed 4.10 SS 4/69
38 1968 Cyclone GT 13.86@101.69 428 CJ 335 automatic 4.11 MT 8/68
39 1969 Nova SS 396 13.87@105.1 396 4V 375 automatic 3.55 HR 7/69
40 1969 Shelby GT-500 13.87@104.52 428 CJ 335 4-Speed 3.91 SS 9/69
41 1969 Cyclone Cobra Jet 13.88@101.7 428 CJ 335 automatic 4.11 MT 1/69
42 1970 Olds 4-4-2 W-30 13.88@95.84 455 W-30 370 automatic 3.42 CC 11/69
43 1962 Corvette 13.89@105.14 327 FI 360 4-Speed 4.10 HR 1/62
44 1969 Barracuda 13.89@103.21 440 4V 375 automatic 4.10 SS 8/69
45 1962 Catalina 13.90@107 421 4V ? 4-Speed 4.30 MT 5/62
46 1969 Mustang Mach I 13.90@103.32 428 CJ 335 automatic 3.50 CL 3/69
47 1967 GTO 13.90@102.8 400 RA 360 automatic 4.33 CL 10/67
48 1970 Trans Am 13.90@102 400 RA 345 4-Speed 3.91 HR 2/70
49 1970 Torino Cobra 13.99@101 429 4V ? 4-Speed 3.91 MT 2/70
Legend: CC=Car Craft, CD=Car and Driver, CL=Car Life, HC=Hi Performance Cars, HR=Hot Rod, MCR=Muscle Car Review, MM=Mopar Muscle, MT=Motor Trend, SS=Super Stock


Fastest Modern Domestic Cars



These are the fastest domestic modern cars in the quarter mile.


FASTEST MODERN DOMESTIC CARS
# YEAR/MODEL ET/MPH ENGINE HP TRANS SOURCE
1 1997 Viper GTS 12.05@116 V10 450 6-Speed MM 8/97
2 2002 Corvette Z06 12.5@114.9 LS6 350 405 6-Speed MT 2/02
3 1990 ZR1 Corvette 12.8@113.8 LT5 350 375 6-Speed MT 4/90
4 1997 Hurst/Firebird 12.99@103.11 350 350 automatic MCR 4/97
5 1992 Viper RT/10 13.1@108 488 V10 400 6-Speed CD 7/92
6 1995 ZR1 Corvette 13.1@112.0 LT5 350 405 6-Speed MT 8/95
7 2001 Corvette Coupe 13.1@109.1 LS1 350 350 6-Speed MT 3/01
8 1997 Corvette 13.20@109.3 350 LS-1 345 6-Speed MT 5/97
9 1997 SLP Camaro SS 13.20@108.8 350 LT4 330 6-Speed MT 2/97
10 1990 Pontiac Firehawk 13.20@107 350 350 6-Speed CD 6/91
11 1996 Camaro Z28 SS 13.46@106.48 350 LT-1 310 6-Speed MCR F/M 96
12 2000 Pontiac Trans Am WS6 13.5@107.4 350 LS1 325 6-Speed MT 12/99
13 2002 Camaro Z28 SS 13.5@107.3 350 LS1 325 6-Speed MT 12/01
14 1995 Mustang Cobra R 13.67@102.82 351 300 5-Speed MCR A/S 95
15 1996 Corvette GS 13.7@105.1 350 LT-4 330 6-Speed RT 2/96
16 1987 Buick GNX 13.70@102 231 Turbo V6 300 automatic HR 4/87
17 2001 SVT Mustang Cobra 13.8@103.3 4.6L V8 320 5-Speed MT 12/01


Imports



For comparison sake, here are a few import 1/4 mile times. Note: Only cars with MSRPs less than $50,000 are on the list, so no exotics. Remember, these are supposed to be affordable.



FASTEST IMPORT CARS
# YEAR/MODEL ET/MPH ENGINE HP TRANS SOURCE
1 2001 BMW M Roadster 13.1@107.6 3.2 I6 315 5-Speed MT 4/02
2 2001 BMW M3 Coupe 13.2@106.9 3.2 I6 333 6-Speed MT 8/01
3 1993 Toyota Supra Turbo 13.4 3.0 V6 Turbo 320 - -
4 1995 Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR-4 13.5 3.0 V6 Turbo 320 - -
5 2000 Honda S2000 13.8@100.5 2.0 I4 240 6-Speed MT 2/00
6 1995 Nissan 300ZX Turbo 13.9 3.0 V6 Turbo - - -
7 1993 Mazda RX-7 R1 13.9 - - - -
8 2002 Subaru Impreza WRX 14.2@94.4 2.0 F4 Turbo 227 5-Speed MT 1/02
9 1995 Toyota MR2 Turbo 14.8 - - - -
10 1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX 14.9 2.0 I4 Turbo - - -
11 2002 Acura RSX Type S 15.1@94.7 2.0 I4 200 6-Speed MT 1/02
11 1994 Honda Prelude VTEC 15.1 @ 93 2.2 I4 190 5-Speed CD 6/94
13 2003 Mitsubishi Eclipse GTS Spyder 15.2@93.0 3.0 V6 210 5-Speed MT 4/02
14 1997 Acura Integra Type R 15.2 1.8 I4 190 5-Speed -
15 2002 Audi A4 Quattro 15.3 3.0 V6 220 6-Speed MT 2/02
16 1997 Acura Integra GS-R 15.5 1.8 I4 170 5-Speed -
17 2002 Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec-V 15.6@90.3 2.0 I4 175 6-Speed MT 4/02
18 1999 Honda Civic Si 15.7 1.6 I4 160 5-Speed -

[David]

If i had the time i'd highlight all the GM cars :)

[4 cam torino]

I was suprised in that article it said the Challenger is actually heavier then the Charger. 4,1XX vs. 4,0XX.


You shouldn't have been. I've posted several times saying it was going to be.

[swaggy853]

2 1966 Corvette 427 12.8@112 L72 427 425 4-Speed 3.36 CD 11/65

I just happen to know where one of these is, same year, engine, hp, gears, convertible tho. Its next to my camaro in the garage.
9 1997 SLP Camaro SS 13.20@108.8 350 LT4 330 6-Speed MT 2/97
10 1990 Pontiac Firehawk 13.20@107 350 350 6-Speed CD 6/91

Soooo the LT1 and the TPI both posted faster times than the almightly LS1. Nice.
11 1994 Honda Prelude VTEC 15.1 @ 93 2.2 I4 190 5-Speed CD 6/94
14 1997 Acura Integra Type R 15.2 1.8 I4 190 5-Speed -


Both 190hp, Prelude is lots heavier, Integra is geared short for the track, yet the Prelude is faster. This shows what can be done with torque.

[Alley]

I'm guessing that is a old list? I don't see a SRT10 Viper or a C6 Vette on there.

oh and LOL at the import list. mega sic fast!!!

[Johnny]

yeah that import list is terrible, THO pretty much NONE of those cars are geared or made for straight line performance, SOOOO many of those on the list would leave any on the domestic list WAY in the dust on a road course. BUTTTTT that is apples to oranges, and we are not talking about that kind of performance right now...

[supercrackerbox]

Turbo Mopar's were running low 14's in 1992?

Martin

Yes.

[redsled]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

[4 cam torino]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

[Alley]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on something.




fixed

[redsled]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

I am actually on to something. I'll even go so far as to say $27K (+ -). When fully loaded SS Impalas are going for low 30s...yeah. It'll happen.

[srt-4_uk]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

I am actually on to something. I'll even go so far as to say $27K (+ -). When fully loaded SS Impalas are going for low 30s...yeah. It'll happen.

I dont really understand that reasoning. So a Camaro with a LS2/3 and RWD is going to cost less than a Impalla with an LS4 and FWD?

[C.J.]

I'm also not buying the ZR1 Vette running low 12's. If that was the case waht the heck is wrong with the 350HP LS1 vette only running 13's stock? They must of took a step backwards in engineering if the LT5 at 385 HP is a full second faster. Guess the LS1 was a step backwards?

Well considering you haven't even heard of the damn car...I am going to not take into account your belief or non-belief in how it performed. It performed on par with the 01 385hp ZO6's which can run 12.2-12.5 all day in the hands of a pro.

"If that was the case waht the heck is wrong with the 350HP LS1 vette only running 13's stock? They must of took a step backwards in engineering if the LT5 at 385 HP is a full second faster"

What was wrong with the 350hp LS1's? Well for one they didn't make as much power, they weren't terrible underrated like the LT5. Oh and funny you said something about step backwards in engineering...when the LT5 was a DOHC 32 valve that revved like crazy...I would call that a step back in engineering. Comparing a c5 ls1 vette to a c4 LT5 ZR1 is pointless, the LT5 motor option was an additional $30,000 dollars. It essentially doubled the price of the vehicle b/c a loaded up LT1 c4 cost around 30k and the LT5 ZR1's were stickered in the low $60k's.

I love arguing with people who don't have the information they should.

[C.J.]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

I have said that in so many new camaro threads I got tired of beating that dead horse b/c some people who don't know what they are talking about always make ignorant comments.

[C.J.]

I dont really understand that reasoning. So a Camaro with a LS2/3 and RWD is going to cost less than a Impalla with an LS4 and FWD?

If you missed it...he said LOADED impala SS aka highest model of that piece of **** that they offer. A base model Z28 6 speed will be mid to high 20s EASILY. That is what makes the car appealing, I dont see why there are so many people who don't understand how this car thing works. Just b/c Mopar is going to jack up their prices on underperforming over hyped bandwagon mullet rides which is probably only so it takes longer for them to hit bottom dollar b/c they depreciated like a rock in a lake...but that is all for another day.

The Camaro has always competed with the Mustang, how much does a brand new base model GT mustang cost? Oh big surprise...mid to low 20's last time I checked, so why would GM do anything different? It would be stupid, its not like GM is retarded (aka Dodge) and trying to sell a cheap car w/ big engine/driveline for the same price as a Cadillac.

Mustangs and Camaro's will always be sold "cheap" b/c that is what makes them appealing. They build the bare minimum car around the best driveline they can put in the chassis. Dodge does the same except builds a cheaper car around a driveline and just adds on 10k.

[srt-4_uk]

Price an Impala SS. It starts at 29,4XX.

[C.J.]

Price an Impala SS. It starts at 29,4XX.

ok so what is your point? We are not saying that the SS camaro will be under 30k.

[srt-4_uk]

I was saying that his comparison to the Impala does not make sense. Thats all.
Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.
That does not make sense to me either. You compare the Camaro to the G8 because they use the same platform. The G8 starts at $29,9 and comes with the L76. So the new Camaro is supposed to have the LS2/3 and be cheaper?

[C.J.]

if anyone knows, 4camtorino knows.

[srt-4_uk]

I am not saying that he doesn't. I am really just trying to understand this.

[Alley]

well, your going off track now talking about the base camaro. We were talking about the top of the line SS just like the top of the line Challenger is the SRT. 2009 will introduce the 5.7 hemi in the Challenger as a base and will be priced way cheaper then the SRT. Probably high 20's, low 30's.

Will the SS have a bigger engine then the Z28? Or just a different exhaust and a 5k markup?

[4 cam torino]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

I have said that in so many new camaro threads I got tired of beating that dead horse b/c some people who don't know what they are talking about always make ignorant comments.


Yeah, it's not hard to understand. If the G8 GT is under 30k, there's no reason for a 6.0L Camaro to not be under 30k was well. Especially considering that they're still trying to compete in a segment that includes the Mustang GT which can be had for what, 26k?

[4 cam torino]

its not like GM is retarded (aka Dodge) and trying to sell a cheap car w/ big engine/driveline for the same price as a Cadillac.


You can buy the 2008 Car of the Year, AKA the Cadillac CTS for less than the Challenger. :rofl: Give me the CTS over the Challenger.

[4 cam torino]

Why even bring up a base Challenger? :rofl: When the SRT is already lame, anything with less power is just a worthless slug that no one with half a brain will buy over a Camaro or Mustang.

[David]

i lub craig.

[Alley]

Pretty sure the base Z28 will be garbage as well. You still didn't asnwer if the SS is going to have a better engine or just a different exhaust. Oh wait, you dont' know. Nobody knows anything about the Camaro yet. Just keep guessing about these super low prices. I'll bump then thread when your wrong.

[David]

I'm pretty sure the GTO MSRP was like $31,300 or something like that...

[srt-4_uk]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

I have said that in so many new camaro threads I got tired of beating that dead horse b/c some people who don't know what they are talking about always make ignorant comments.


Yeah, it's not hard to understand. If the G8 GT is under 30k, there's no reason for a 6.0L Camaro to not be under 30k was well. Especially considering that they're still trying to compete in a segment that includes the Mustang GT which can be had for what, 26k?

The G8 GT uses the L76 which puts out 361hp 385tq. Starts @ 29,995
The Charger R/T uses the 5.7 hemi that puts out 340hp 390tq and starts @ 31,430
The 09 Charger R/T uses the new 5.7 hemi that puts out 380 hp 404tq and should be around the same price.
That seems like a pretty good comparison to me.

[David]

might i mention that the base model GT with it's 5spd solid axle drivetrain is 26k. The maro will have a more power, IRS and a 6pd. I guess i dont get how they can make it cheaper than the GTO.

[GTPpower]

The guy driving the charger still won't have to worry about what the back end of the G8 looks like.

[redsled]

Base Camaro 6-spd, LS2 under 30K guaranteed.

I think someone might be on to something.

Camaro = Zeta = G8 ... I'm not saying I know anything, but it's a pretty simple equation.

I am actually on to something. I'll even go so far as to say $27K (+ -). When fully loaded SS Impalas are going for low 30s...yeah. It'll happen.

I dont really understand that reasoning. So a Camaro with a LS2/3 and RWD is going to cost less than a Impalla with an LS4 and FWD?

C.J. got my back on this one, but yes. I am saying that. The base Camaro WON'T have leather, heated seats, premium radio with XM, sunroof, four doors, dual A/C controls, etc. It's simple. Think about it.

Price an Impala SS. It starts at 29,4XX.

Trust me. I work at DuTeau Chevrolet. I know what they cost.

[redsled]

I'm pretty sure the GTO MSRP was like $31,300 or something like that...

They've stickered at Husker for $29,xxx.

[4 cam torino]

You're right, I know nothing about the Camaro. I wasn't just standing next to one. The one i wasn't standing next to wasn't outside. It wasn't black. It had padding all over it. It wasn't running sitting there with it's exhaust that doesn't sound the least bit decent at idle and I didn't find out what engine was making the sounds I was hearing. And since I didn't find out any of that stuff I don't know that the Challenger really is completely ****ed. :) Now remove all the negatives and add a negative the the one sentence that didn't have one.

I didn't just drive a V8 Colorado either... Unfortunately before not driving the V8 Colorado I really did swap the 4WD switch panel out to get some switches in it for a durability test being run tomorrow. The switches the durability is being run on are for one without stability and traction control. The V8 ones do have that and i had to toss the traction control switch in behind the switch panel inside the dash so I couldn't reach it. So it was no fun to drive in 2WD but it got up and moved in 4WD.

[swaggy853]

You're right, I know nothing about the Camaro. I wasn't just standing next to one. The one i wasn't standing next to wasn't outside. It wasn't black. It had padding all over it. It wasn't running sitting there with it's exhaust that doesn't sound the least bit decent at idle and I didn't find out what engine was making the sounds I was hearing. And since I didn't find out any of that stuff I don't know that the Challenger really is completely ****ed. :) Now remove all the negatives and add a negative the the one sentence that didn't have one.

I didn't just drive a V8 Colorado either... Unfortunately before not driving the V8 Colorado I really did swap the 4WD switch panel out to get some switches in it for a durability test being run tomorrow. The switches the durability is being run on are for one without stability and traction control. The V8 ones do have that and i had to toss the traction control switch in behind the switch panel inside the dash so I couldn't reach it. So it was no fun to drive in 2WD but it got up and moved in 4WD.

I dont love it already.

[matt]

****

[Cobra Commander]

Alley's knowledge on the older ZR1 is very humorous. :lol:

[David]

I'm pretty sure the GTO MSRP was like $31,300 or something like that...

They've stickered at Husker for $29,xxx.


Thats only because they could NOT sell them.. Fact GM released the 06 hoods early and sent them to dealships so they could paint them and install them on the 05's to help sell them.

http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/pricing.aspx?year=2006&make=Pontiac&model=GTO

First link that popped up during a google.
2006 GTO
Original Retail Price (MSRP) (http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/glossary.aspx?area=Used%20Cars#retail)$31,290Origi nal Invoice Price (http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/glossary.aspx?area=Used%20Cars#invoice)$29,569

I could be wrong... prices of cars are not on the decline...

[C.J.]

You're right, I know nothing about the Camaro. I wasn't just standing next to one. The one i wasn't standing next to wasn't outside. It wasn't black. It had padding all over it. It wasn't running sitting there with it's exhaust that doesn't sound the least bit decent at idle and I didn't find out what engine was making the sounds I was hearing. And since I didn't find out any of that stuff I don't know that the Challenger really is completely ****ed. :) Now remove all the negatives and add a negative the the one sentence that didn't have one.

I didn't just drive a V8 Colorado either... Unfortunately before not driving the V8 Colorado I really did swap the 4WD switch panel out to get some switches in it for a durability test being run tomorrow. The switches the durability is being run on are for one without stability and traction control. The V8 ones do have that and i had to toss the traction control switch in behind the switch panel inside the dash so I couldn't reach it. So it was no fun to drive in 2WD but it got up and moved in 4WD.

OMG i am not already excited to see this base model Z28 walk allover that SRwhatevfer it is challenger.

Alley's knowledge on the older ZR1 is very humorous. :lol:

I am glad you finally jumped in here and gave me some support, I know you know whats up.

[4 cam torino]

I don't know what trim level any running around the proving grounds are. But IF there is a 6.0L version (I'm going to go with there isn't unless it's the L76 and not the LS2) then the SS is going to have a different engine than the Z-28.

I'm pretty sure the LS2 is completely dead, could be wrong. There are still 6.0L's but there all L76's and Hybrids.

[C.J.]

I want an LS3 option bare minimum.

[4 cam torino]

:ohnoes:

[C.J.]

that is IF i am going to consider buying one. It will take a minimum of LS3 engine + T56 + nice rear gear ratio

[4 cam torino]

Gears are cheap. I'm pretty sure they stopped making the T-56 though :) I think they're all 6060's now.

[C.J.]

what is a 6060?

edit nvm...sounds nice.

Oh and holy ****...rated to 600lb-ft torque, i might even have trouble breaking that SOB

[Alley]

Since you know so much about the Camaro what did the sticker price say?

I'm pretty much a fountain of knowledge. Smarts explode out of me and go flying everywhere. So watch out.

[C.J.]

Since you know so much about the Camaro what did the sticker price say?

I'm pretty much a fountain of knowledge. Smarts explode out of me and go flying everywhere. So watch out.

your fountains pump must be broken then. :)

[4 cam torino]

None of them even have real head lights yet :rofl: The headlights work, they just aren't the production ones.

[redsled]

Bard, or Brad whatever your name is, I have a question for you. Are you saying the V8 Colorados will have a 4x4 option?

David, yeah that's what I had figured; that they couldn't sell them and lowered the MSRP.

[4 cam torino]

Why wouldn't the V8 Colorado have a 4x4 option? And I wouldn't have one if it didn't have a 4x4 option, because I'm in transfer cases. I just wish the calibration group would finish their **** so I could drive it instead of the I-5 one i've been driving :)

[turbodaytona87]

They have an I-5 as an option?

[Cobra Commander]

Gears are cheap. I'm pretty sure they stopped making the T-56 though :) I think they're all 6060's now.

The name 6060 reminds me too much of the 3650. Lets hope they don't eat syncros every oil change.... :lol:

[Cobra Commander]

Alley's knowledge on the older ZR1 is very humorous. :lol:

I am glad you finally jumped in here and gave me some support, I know you know whats up.

The ZR1 was an awesome car. Much more awesome then the Viper. The Viper had the "omg new car" appeal back then, so every noob thinks that car was superior over everything including the ZR1, which wasn't true.

[c0z]

They have an I-5 as an option?

Yeah, they have been for quite a while now.

[supercrackerbox]

They have an I-5 as an option?

Yeah, they have been for quite a while now.

I thought it was the standard engine, basically the I-6 from the Trailblazer less one cylinder. :hmm:

[4 cam torino]

I thought the I-5 was standard too but I'm not sure after seeing a 4 cylinder one on my vehicle list. I was trying to find it Friday and they told me it got disposed of. I'm sure the guy who was doing the test driving to validate some parts appreciated getting to drive the V-8 one for a whole shift instead of the 4 cylinder one as a result of it's disposal. Maybe the 4 never made production. Just checked, there is a 2.9L 4 cylinder option. The I-5 is indeed the trailblazer engine with a cylinder whacked off. I think that 4 cylinder is the same deal, obviously with one more cylinder whacked off, but I could be wrong.

[82355]

Alley's knowledge on the older ZR1 is very humorous. :lol:

As is most of his automotive knowledge.

Martin

[turbodaytona87]

I didn't necessarily mean it was an option and not standard, just wierd that they use an odd number of cylinders

[Alley]

Well this thread has pretty much gone in the trash. Why the **** are we talking about a Colorado?

[4 cam torino]

Because a V8 Colorado is more bad ass than the lame piece of **** this thread was started about :rofl:

[Alley]

doubtfull

[c0z]

I thought the I-5 was standard too but I'm not sure after seeing a 4 cylinder one on my vehicle list. I was trying to find it Friday and they told me it got disposed of. I'm sure the guy who was doing the test driving to validate some parts appreciated getting to drive the V-8 one for a whole shift instead of the 4 cylinder one as a result of it's disposal. Maybe the 4 never made production. Just checked, there is a 2.9L 4 cylinder option. The I-5 is indeed the trailblazer engine with a cylinder whacked off. I think that 4 cylinder is the same deal, obviously with one more cylinder whacked off, but I could be wrong.

Yeah, since they came out the base have been 4 cyl, and the "higher" model have been the 5ers.

[Preston]

This thread delivers!

[David]

someone gonna answer me????

how they gonna make the new V8 whatever model cheaper than the GTO... also how is it not going to be in the same weight class as the chall. when the GTO was??? anyone?

[David]

what i'm curious about... since the t/a has never been mroe than panels and interior compared to it's camaro brother... is there any chance pontiac will jump on board and put out a firebird.. cuz thats what i really care about.

[C.J.]

hopefully pontiac just dies out along with oldmosbile, buick, etc.

[Yogi]

I finally agree with CJ on something.

[00dakotav8]

Which v8 are they planning on putting in the colorado? There has been rumors since it released that the 6.0 will be squeezed in there but nothing yet.

[supercrackerbox]

I finally agree with CJ on something.

I'm not going to agree so far as to say that I hope it happens, but I do believe it is going to happen within the next decade.

[4 cam torino]

someone gonna answer me????

how they gonna make the new V8 whatever model cheaper than the GTO... also how is it not going to be in the same weight class as the chall. when the GTO was??? anyone?

Ummm...the weight category thing, it's WAY smaller. The Camaro is smaller than the Mustang. The Challenger is way bigger than both.

[4 cam torino]

hopefully pontiac just dies out along with oldmosbile, buick, etc.

No way man, Pontiac is working on being all RWD based cars. **** Saturn and Chevy, keep Pontiac :woot:

[4 cam torino]

Which v8 are they planning on putting in the colorado? There has been rumors since it released that the 6.0 will be squeezed in there but nothing yet.

I've heard nothing about an SS version but I suppose it's possible. The SS concept is what started it all. The 5.3L is going to be the normal option for '09.

[¿umop apisdn]

hopefully pontiac just dies out along with oldmosbile, buick, etc.

No way man, Pontiac is working on being all RWD based cars. **** Saturn and Chevy, keep Pontiac :woot:

They gotta stay alive until I can afford a G8 GT as a daily!

[C.J.]

I do love the looks of the G8 GT i suppose.

[Cobra Commander]

hopefully pontiac just dies out along with oldmosbile, buick, etc.

Lets hope Ford goes with em, minus the truck line of course. :lol:

[BossRoss]

hopefully pontiac just dies out along with oldmosbile, buick, etc.

Lets hope Ford goes with em, minus the truck line of course. :lol:


pontiac will never die. im still waitin for the firebird to come back.

[matt]

hopefully pontiac just dies out along with oldmosbile, buick, etc.

[Alley]

It's Official - Camaro to be Lame Piece of ****

[Cobra Commander]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXPTuN-BeKU

[4 cam torino]

It's Official - Camaro to be Lame Piece of ****

I don't see GM releasing official info on their car saying that they have a 425 HP 13 second car that gets 18 MPG if you breathe in while facing forward and turn your head and breathe out while facing backwards.

Mopar has only themselves to blame for having a lame car that results from under engineering a 2 door out of a 4 door and ending up with a smaller car that still somehow weighs more.

Don't hate because you left the good side for the shitty side and now you want back but can't do it.

[Alley]

Trust me, there's nothing GM has right now that appeals to me in the slightest.

[David]

someone gonna answer me????

how they gonna make the new V8 whatever model cheaper than the GTO... also how is it not going to be in the same weight class as the chall. when the GTO was??? anyone?

Ummm...the weight category thing, it's WAY smaller. The Camaro is smaller than the Mustang. The Challenger is way bigger than both.

how is it way smaller than the GTO? i haven't stayed up todate on it... can't say i care that much right now... but i'm under the impression it's going to be right in the same weight class as the G8... which is what like 3750 give or take a few... The GTO came in a touch over 3700 i believe... Same drivetrain possibly more weight.. i'm sorry but it's going to be the GTO without the lame exterior.

[¿umop apisdn]

Wait, is this right? Will the challenger really not have a hand break?
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/the-gee/challengersrt8int.jpg

[Alley]

Nice red X.

[¿umop apisdn]

serious? I can see it ****. FIXED

[C.J.]

another surprising interior from our friends at Dodge!

[82355]

I didn't necessarily mean it was an option and not standard, just wierd that they use an odd number of cylinders

You are the MOPAr nut licker, what do you think that pile of **** V10 is?

Martin

[c0z]

He doesn't care that a V-10 has two banks of 5, it's an even number which makes it right!

[82355]

He is about that stupid.

Martin

[Alley]

Whats the point of a hand break on a automatic anyway?

[82355]

What is the point of an automatic???

Martin

[Cobra Commander]

another surprising interior from our friends at Dodge!

Hahahaha. I was just about to make fun of that lame ass, plastic infested interior. GO MOPAR!

[Cobra Commander]

What is the point of an automatic???

Martin

To outrun highschool homos trying to impress their 17 year old girlfriends with their MANUAL RACE CAR! !

[turbodaytona87]

He doesn't care that a V-10 has two banks of 5, it's an even number which makes it right!

Kinda, I mean we have a I4, I6, V6, V8, V10, V12, then an I5 shows up, just kinda odd

[turbodaytona87]

I didn't necessarily mean it was an option and not standard, just wierd that they use an odd number of cylinders

You are the MOPAr nut licker, what do you think that pile of **** V10 is?

Martin

An even number?

[c0z]

The point is it's two I5s positioned in a V type configuration. And theres been odd numbers used for years. Two mass produced off the top of my head are Geos 3 cyl and Volvos 5 Cyl...

[Alley]

What is the point of an automatic???

Martin

Gee, I dunno. Consistant Track Times? Better Launches? No missed gears?

[82355]

I didn't necessarily mean it was an option and not standard, just wierd that they use an odd number of cylinders

You are the MOPAr nut licker, what do you think that pile of **** V10 is?

Martin

An even number?

Yep, retarded. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Martin

[82355]

What is the point of an automatic???

Martin

Gee, I dunno. Consistant Track Times? Better Launches? No missed gears?

and?

Martin

[00dakotav8]

It's not fun....^^^ Someone want to help me swap in a 5 spd this summer? The hole in the floor was cut from the factory....

[82355]

Unless your car has no plates and only one tailight, there is no excuse for an automatic.

Martin

[Cobra Commander]

I love automatics. I've owned 10 different manual cars.

[82355]

I hate automatics and have owned many of them, but if you buy a "new car" and have the option of buying the manual and get the automatic, you just love the ****. Or you are turbomopartona87dickwad.

Martin

[Cobra Commander]

Can't argue that.

[Cobra Commander]

So let me gather some information here.

~ No faster then a Mustang GT
~ Price tag comparible to a GT500
~ Heavier then a GTO or GT500
~ No manual transmission

Uh........ :joe:

[turbodaytona87]

I hate automatics and have owned many of them, but if you buy a "new car" and have the option of buying the manual and get the automatic, you just love the ****. Or you are turbomopartona87dickwad.

Martin

Don't worry my mightierthanthouasshole, I have a manual

[C.J.]

So let me gather some information here.

~ No faster then a Mustang GT
~ Price tag comparible to a GT500
~ Heavier then a GTO or GT500
~ No manual transmission

Uh........ :joe:

GOT DAYUM CLEETUS that sounds like a helluva deal!

i mean ****...its got navigation!

[¿umop apisdn]

You can buy 07 Z51 Vettes for 39,000 now....but....I don't know. I think I'd still take the challenger

/sarcasm.

[Cobra Commander]

GOT DAYUM CLEETUS that sounds like a helluva deal!

Hahaha. No ****.


You can buy 07 Z51 Vettes for 39,000 now...

But why buy something like that when you can have a lame ass Mopar?

[4 cam torino]

David, you can't base the Camaro's size on the fact that the Transformer Camaro was built out of a GTO. You can shorten **** and change the wheel base while your cutting the whole ****ing body off the car you know. The GTO was not on ZETA. And the Camaro dimensions don't have to be the same as a G8. The platform isn't the entire floor layout as you are trying to make it out to be. It's mainly lots of common components. And 3700 lbs is a hell of a lot better than 4100. They've published numbers on the Camaro's length and everything. You can go find them if you really want to see them, I don't have time to dig them up.

[Alley]

David, you can't base the Camaro's size on the fact that the Transformer Camaro was built out of a GTO. You can shorten **** and change the wheel base while your cutting the whole ****ing body off the car you know. The GTO was not on ZETA. And the Camaro dimensions don't have to be the same as a G8. The platform isn't the entire floor layout as you are trying to make it out to be. It's mainly lots of common components. And 3700 lbs is a hell of a lot better than 4100. They've published numbers on the Camaro's length and everything. You can go find them if you really want to see them, I don't have time to dig them up.

I thought you already knew everything about the Camaro since you saw it in person and listened to the exhaust?

Also, how can you guys dog the Challenger interior? don't you remember the Camaro interior?

http://x3d.xanga.com/d12820e2c9d58167151200/b126497016.jpg

[4 cam torino]

Yeah, because I stood there with a tape measure and measured the wheel base, length, width, etc. and there was an out of production car sitting there next to it here at a place where we develop new products so I could get a direct comparison between the two. :roll:

[Alley]

Yeah, because I stood there with a tape measure and measured the wheel base, length, width, etc. and there was an out of production car sitting there next to it here at a place where we develop new products so I could get a direct comparison between the two. :roll:

Ok, so give us the info then.

[c0z]

Both the camaro and challenger interior are gay.. haha. Good lord, the auto shifters on both couldn't be gayer.

[GTPpower]

David, you can't base the Camaro's size on the fact that the Transformer Camaro was built out of a GTO. You can shorten **** and change the wheel base while your cutting the whole ****ing body off the car you know. The GTO was not on ZETA. And the Camaro dimensions don't have to be the same as a G8. The platform isn't the entire floor layout as you are trying to make it out to be. It's mainly lots of common components. And 3700 lbs is a hell of a lot better than 4100. They've published numbers on the Camaro's length and everything. You can go find them if you really want to see them, I don't have time to dig them up.

I thought you already knew everything about the Camaro since you saw it in person and listened to the exhaust?

Also, how can you guys dog the Challenger interior? don't you remember the Camaro interior?

http://x3d.xanga.com/d12820e2c9d58167151200/b126497016.jpg

Yeah...I'll bet the production interior looks like that:Hammer::sillyme:

[Yogi]

I bet it's damn close to that.

[4 cam torino]

The colorization is definitely better now.

[82355]

I hate automatics and have owned many of them, but if you buy a "new car" and have the option of buying the manual and get the automatic, you just love the ****. Or you are turbomopartona87dickwad.

Martin

Don't worry my mightierthanthouasshole, I have a manual

And you are still a retarded dumb****.

Martin

[82355]

Both the camaro and challenger interior are gay.. haha. Good lord, the auto shifters on both couldn't be gayer.

They are trying to compete with the god awful interior in the 05 Mustang.

Martin

[Cobra Commander]

Both the camaro and challenger interior are gay.. haha. Good lord, the auto shifters on both couldn't be gayer.

They are trying to compete with the god awful interior in the 05 Mustang.

Martin

I don't know. that is pretty hard to beat. :lol:

[82355]

It is really sad that such a beautiful car has such an awful interior.

Martin

[4 cam torino]

The Mustang head rests especially suck. I hate the whole car because of them.

[Cobra Commander]

It isn't a Mustang if the interior doesn't suck.

[C.J.]

It isn't a mopar if the interior doesn't suck.

Edited for true accuracy. I mean honestly 03/04 cobra interior is like a bentley compared to anything mopar can come up with.

[86Shelby]

Edited for true accuracy. I mean honestly 03/04 cobra interior is like a bentley compared to anything mopar can come up with.

You mean aside from the fact that it was horribly outdated and fugly when it was first used in '94? Not many cars can boast that thier top tier model only swaps seats, radios and guages when compared to the base model which is already a decade old. Yay Cobra!:woot:

[¿umop apisdn]

I believe the keyword there is COMPARED TO. Sure, it may not be the best thing ever, but COMPARED TO Mopar stuff, it's great.

[Cobra Commander]

Edited for true accuracy. I mean honestly 03/04 cobra interior is like a bentley compared to anything mopar can come up with.

You mean aside from the fact that it was horribly outdated and fugly when it was first used in '94? Not many cars can boast that thier top tier model only swaps seats, radios and guages when compared to the base model which is already a decade old. Yay Cobra!:woot:

Very true, BUT the seats really are nice. That doesn't count for much, but my ass likes sitting in a Cobra.

[matt]

STOMP THAT ****
GET OWNED

[4 cam torino]

After this thread: http://starcityracing.com/Forums/showthread.php?t=6441

Do we still have doubters of the fact that the Camaro with a little more displacement than the G8 is going to annihilate the Challenger? It won't even take a top of the line Camaro to annihilate the Challenger :lol:

[¿umop apisdn]

I think it'll just take gears for the G8 to take the SRT. Do we know what gears the Camaro's going to have?

[STOK5OH]

5.83's

[C.J.]

my guess....3.42s GM loves em'